And you sound profoundly arrogant. It has been a comfort reading here (and at TED, Julie Roys, and other sites revealing the truth) of others who are working through this. I believe that if I hadnt been a strong donor, I would not have been considered and wouldnt have vaulted through Harvest leadership over more deserving peers. A friend became nearly apoplectic when I tried to explain this. To be brief. I never thought I would say such a thing about a church plant but, these young reformers are more about planting reformed theology, rather than Gospel churches. The big issue I have is with the idea that there is this one leader, a high office that this one guy occupies in a church called the pastor. And not many have truly repented I think. with or without religious trappings. It was given to the elders two months ago. Ive heard the voice of my Savior, I couldnt post that letter due to my absolute disgust at the depths to which MacDonald has sunk. Not just then but through darker times which subsequently came (including our own trials with another Harvest outlet). Maybe that was why Elmer Gantry had such impact. We all are that person which is why we still need Jesus daily to save us from our continuing sin patterns in our life. (baby dont hurt me no more) Maybe JMs associates and enablers thought the most loving thing was to go along with JM for the sake of the everlasting benefits in heaven that would be experienced in the future by the people who were being abused, manipulated, fleeced here under the sun, but who nevertheless were hearing the gospel (as they understood gospel), even though it looks to us like it was being preached from false motives. And of course you. In any normal group setting, the members will naturally turn to the most mature and experienced among them for direction and advice. Quit trying to privatize and hide in secret that which should be public. Im, however, convinced that the original disciples didnt completely understand what Jesus intended, nor were they able to carry out His intentions without sin in the mixture. Association of Related Churches Dallas Jenkins (born July 25, 1975) is an American film and television director, writer and film producer. Backfired twice over. having faithful children Are we any better? Founded in 1988, it has grown to seven campuses in the Chicago metropolitan area. The time for half measures is over. Indeed. Thats a rare bird, indeed, in the American church. James and you have lived a lifestyle for a long time of trying to prove that Jesus lied. My cousin belongs to a house church in western Iowa. We simply interpret the words through a different filter. dee: Its like dj vu all over again. -Yogi Berra, When you come to a fork in the road, take it. -Yogi Berra. He was evidently so invested in making the Dramatic Point and leaving a Big Impression that I dont think he considered anyone else at that moment. But no matter what, it will get bent quickly if thats whats happening. If all this was that important to the leaders they would have been apoplectic at what they witnessed from JM. just Zero current power holders at Willow Creek Community Church have uttered a single word condemning the sexual crimes of founder and 42 year leader Bill Hybels. He is best known as the creator, director and co-writer of The Chosen, the first multi-season series about the life of Jesus of Nazareth.. Jenkins's career is focused on faith-based media. Dallas failed to mention that Fred Adams, James MacDonald and Luke MacDonald were listed as Producers for one of his film projects. The first service in this new house of God was held on September 10, 1995. So instead of trying to defend these rascals, I prefer to inform and warn the church about the wolves in their midst rather than giving them a break. I know we have to hunt to keep down the population of wild creatures, especially in areas where they dont have any natural predators, so they dont destroy the environment and/or starve. A person who thinks they are qualified, is someone who may need to take some time to discern whether thats true. Known for its racial and economic diversity, the congregation moved into a converted warehouse in Rolling Meadows, Illinois, in 1995. There are other places for the truly repentant to serve in the church. What in the world is going on? Remember when we videotaped us all playing The Name Game? I say run. You shouldve released your statement the first time around. words like unsaved, which always has the connotation of someone to be wary of. WHERE TO FIND US. Certainly! not given to wine Since then, the output of Christ-adoring songs from various worship team members has continued to accelerate. Where in scripture does God say that elders have authority over those they care for, or that elders should rule over them? Dallas, you have a lot to learn about life, and perhaps a lot to learn about the One Who spoke of whispers in the inner rooms being shouted from rooftops. Its not like a plurality of elders guarantees anything, or multiple pastors is anything special. Greg Laurie, pastor and founder of the 15,000-member Harvest, announced the move in June. I believe that would be the consensus of the Body of Christ at large, after getting a glimpse of his shenanigans. In the Seventies, I got mixed up in an end-of-the-world cult Fellowship(TM) that didnt have any single leader figure only a plurality of (20-to-25-year old) elders. Even during confusion, never-ending drama, attacks and holding fast the faithful word Milky Way timelapse photobombed by the Aurora Borealis over Loch More in Scotland. Power provides for itself and money and sex. Will they stay quiet on "awkward" victim stories? Prayer and then in person, second after trying that, you are to take a witness in Christ / go with a brother in Christ to confront, then and only then you must take the church elders and confront your brother that he may turn and forsake his sins. I read an article yesterday about small mainstream churches driven to the wall by the migration to the megas being forced to lease their vacant during the week facilities to small businesses in order to generate enough income to keep the doors open. +++++++++++++++++++. Some comments lead to some questions. Guys like you have no fear of God, and this is how this mess happened in the first place. I am generally ignorant regarding legal or business matters, but isnt this illegal? I read your posts as a searing, agonized, utterly sincere *cri de ceour. Muslin, fka Dee Holmes: So, so much we dont know. Bad decisions lead to pain. Since I hate group think, we did not go. Can you really fault someone for thinking that maybe they got their ideas on Pastors & elders wrong? Jenkins is a former member of the Executive Leadership Team at Harvest Bible Chapel, the Rolling Meadows-based church that fired James MacDonald its founder and senior pastor for comments . 7,646 were here. Nathan Priddis: I was led to view Clement of Rome as a sort of beloved father in our historical progression. Harvest Bible Chapel issued a statement today: Pastor James MacDonald came upon a sleeping bear while walking in the back yard of his modest home today. (Amy, thanks for the clarification on Amy/Lauren). Most of those who attended my former Calvinist Church have wandered back to non-Reformed churches; several others have rejected God altogether. Every man has his price, or a guy like me couldnt exist. Culty. I dont think one can derive that theory from that word showing up once in the entire NT in Peg 4, 4th in a list. Neither Dean Butters nor I wanted our letters published. i agree, Paul has worthy things to say that are beneficial.